The Symposium [8]
Plat. "Theaet." 142 D.
You have not forgotten (interposed Antisthenes), perhaps, that besides yourself there is not a rhapsodist who does not know these epics?
Forgotten! is it likely (he replied), considering I had to listen to them almost daily?
Ant. And did you ever come across a sillier tribe of people than these same rhapsodists?[13]
[13] Cf. "Mem." IV. ii. 10.
Nic. Not I, indeed. Don't ask me to defend their wits.
It is plain (suggested Socrates), they do not know the underlying meaning.[14] But you, Niceratus, have paid large sums of money to Anaximander, and Stesimbrotus, and many others,[15] so that no single point in all that costly lore is lost upon you.[16] But what (he added, turning to Critobulus) do you most pride yourself upon?
[14] i.e. "they haven't the key (of knowledge) to the allegorical or spiritual meaning of the sacred text." Cf. Plat. "Crat." 407; "Ion," 534; "Rep." 378, 387; "Theaet." 180; "Prot." 316. See Grote, "H. G." i. 564.
[15] See Aristot. "Rhet." iii. 11, 13. "Or we may describe Niceratus [not improbably our friend] as a 'Philoctetes stung by Pratys,' using the simile of Thrasymachus when he saw Niceratus after his defeat by Pratys in the rhapsody with his hair still dishevelled and his face unwashed."--Welldon. As to Stesimbrotus, see Plat. "Ion," 530: "Ion. Very true, Socrates; interpretation has certainly been the most laborious part of my art; and I believe myself able to speak about Homer better than any man; and that neither Metrodorus of Lampsacus, nor Stesimbrotus of Thasos, nor Glaucon, nor any one else who ever was, had as good ideas about Homer, or as many of them, as I have."--Jowett. Anaximander, probably of Lampsacus, the author of a {'Erologia}; see Cobet, "Pros. Xen." p. 8.
[16] Or, "you will not have forgotten one point of all that precious teaching." Like Sir John Falstaff's page (2 "Henry IV." ii. 2. 100), Niceratus, no doubt, has got many "a crown's worth of good interpretations."
On beauty (answered Critobulus).
What (Socrates rejoined), shall you be able to maintain that by your beauty you can make us better?
Crit. That will I, or prove myself a shabby sort of person.
Soc. Well, and what is it you pride yourself upon, Antisthenes?
On wealth (he answered).
Whereupon Hermogenes inquired: Had he then a large amount of money?[17]
[17] i.e. "out at interest," or, "in the funds," as we should say.
Not one sixpence:[18] that I swear to you (he answered).
[18] Lit. "not an obol" = "a threepenny bit," circa.
Herm. Then you possess large property in land?
Ant. Enough, I daresay, for the youngster there, Autolycus, to dust himself withal.[19]
[19] i.e. "to sprinkle himself with sand, after anointing." Cf. Lucian, xxxviii., "Amor." 45.
Well, we will lend you our ears, when your turn comes (exclaimed the others).
Soc. And do you now tell us, Charmides, on what you pride yourself.
Oh, I, for my part, pride myself on poverty (he answered).
Upon my word, a charming business! (exclaimed Socrates). Poverty! of all things the least liable to envy; seldom, if ever, an object of contention;[20] never guarded, yet always safe; the more you starve it, the stronger it grows.
[20] Cf. Plat. "Rep." 521 A; "Laws," 678 C.
And you, Socrates, yourself (their host demanded), what is it you pride yourself upon?
Then he, with knitted brows, quite solemnly: On pandering.[21] And when they laughed to hear him say this,[22] he continued: Laugh to your hearts content, my friends; but I am certain I could make a fortune, if I chose to practise this same art.
[21] Or, more politely, "on playing the go-between." See Grote, "H. G." viii. 457, on the "extremely Aristophanic" character of the "Symposium" of Xenophon.
[22] "Him, the master, thus declare himself."
At this point Lycon, turning to Philippus: We need not ask you what you take the chiefest pride in. What can it be, you laughter-making man, except to set folk laughing?
Yes
You have not forgotten (interposed Antisthenes), perhaps, that besides yourself there is not a rhapsodist who does not know these epics?
Forgotten! is it likely (he replied), considering I had to listen to them almost daily?
Ant. And did you ever come across a sillier tribe of people than these same rhapsodists?[13]
[13] Cf. "Mem." IV. ii. 10.
Nic. Not I, indeed. Don't ask me to defend their wits.
It is plain (suggested Socrates), they do not know the underlying meaning.[14] But you, Niceratus, have paid large sums of money to Anaximander, and Stesimbrotus, and many others,[15] so that no single point in all that costly lore is lost upon you.[16] But what (he added, turning to Critobulus) do you most pride yourself upon?
[14] i.e. "they haven't the key (of knowledge) to the allegorical or spiritual meaning of the sacred text." Cf. Plat. "Crat." 407; "Ion," 534; "Rep." 378, 387; "Theaet." 180; "Prot." 316. See Grote, "H. G." i. 564.
[15] See Aristot. "Rhet." iii. 11, 13. "Or we may describe Niceratus [not improbably our friend] as a 'Philoctetes stung by Pratys,' using the simile of Thrasymachus when he saw Niceratus after his defeat by Pratys in the rhapsody with his hair still dishevelled and his face unwashed."--Welldon. As to Stesimbrotus, see Plat. "Ion," 530: "Ion. Very true, Socrates; interpretation has certainly been the most laborious part of my art; and I believe myself able to speak about Homer better than any man; and that neither Metrodorus of Lampsacus, nor Stesimbrotus of Thasos, nor Glaucon, nor any one else who ever was, had as good ideas about Homer, or as many of them, as I have."--Jowett. Anaximander, probably of Lampsacus, the author of a {'Erologia}; see Cobet, "Pros. Xen." p. 8.
[16] Or, "you will not have forgotten one point of all that precious teaching." Like Sir John Falstaff's page (2 "Henry IV." ii. 2. 100), Niceratus, no doubt, has got many "a crown's worth of good interpretations."
On beauty (answered Critobulus).
What (Socrates rejoined), shall you be able to maintain that by your beauty you can make us better?
Crit. That will I, or prove myself a shabby sort of person.
Soc. Well, and what is it you pride yourself upon, Antisthenes?
On wealth (he answered).
Whereupon Hermogenes inquired: Had he then a large amount of money?[17]
[17] i.e. "out at interest," or, "in the funds," as we should say.
Not one sixpence:[18] that I swear to you (he answered).
[18] Lit. "not an obol" = "a threepenny bit," circa.
Herm. Then you possess large property in land?
Ant. Enough, I daresay, for the youngster there, Autolycus, to dust himself withal.[19]
[19] i.e. "to sprinkle himself with sand, after anointing." Cf. Lucian, xxxviii., "Amor." 45.
Well, we will lend you our ears, when your turn comes (exclaimed the others).
Soc. And do you now tell us, Charmides, on what you pride yourself.
Oh, I, for my part, pride myself on poverty (he answered).
Upon my word, a charming business! (exclaimed Socrates). Poverty! of all things the least liable to envy; seldom, if ever, an object of contention;[20] never guarded, yet always safe; the more you starve it, the stronger it grows.
[20] Cf. Plat. "Rep." 521 A; "Laws," 678 C.
And you, Socrates, yourself (their host demanded), what is it you pride yourself upon?
Then he, with knitted brows, quite solemnly: On pandering.[21] And when they laughed to hear him say this,[22] he continued: Laugh to your hearts content, my friends; but I am certain I could make a fortune, if I chose to practise this same art.
[21] Or, more politely, "on playing the go-between." See Grote, "H. G." viii. 457, on the "extremely Aristophanic" character of the "Symposium" of Xenophon.
[22] "Him, the master, thus declare himself."
At this point Lycon, turning to Philippus: We need not ask you what you take the chiefest pride in. What can it be, you laughter-making man, except to set folk laughing?
Yes