THEAETETUS [16]
is practised by
the many, will have just the opposite effect upon him; and as he grows
older, instead of turning philosopher, he will come to hate
philosophy. I would recommend you, therefore, as I said before, not to
encourage yourself in this polemical and controversial temper, but
to find out, in a friendly and congenial spirit, what we really mean
when we say that all things are in motion, and that to every
individual and state what appears, is. In this manner you will
consider whether knowledge and sensation are the same or different,
but you will not argue, as you were just now doing, from the customary
use of names and words, which the vulgar pervert in all sorts of ways,
causing infinite perplexity to one another. Such, Theodorus, is the
very slight help which I am able to offer to your old friend; had he
been living, he would have helped himself in a far more gloriose
style.
Theod. You are jesting, Socrates; indeed, your defence of him has
been most valorous.
Soc. Thank you, friend; and I hope that you observed Protagoras
bidding us be serious, as the text, "Man is the measure of all
things," was a solemn one; and he reproached us with making a boy
the medium of discourse, and said that the boy's timidity was made
to tell against his argument; he also declared that we made a joke
of him.
Theod. How could I fail to observe all that, Socrates?
Soc. Well, and shall we do as he says?
Theod. By all means.
Soc. But if his wishes are to be regarded, you and I must take up
the argument, and in all seriousness, and ask and answer one
another, for you see that the rest of us are nothing but boys. In no
other way can we escape the imputation, that in our fresh analysis
of his thesis we are making fun with boys.
Theod. Well, but is not Theaetetus better able to follow a
philosophical enquiry than a great many men who have long beards?
Soc. Yes, Theodorus, but not better than you; and therefore please
not to imagine that I am to defend by every means in my power your
departed friend; and that you are to defend nothing and nobody. At any
rate, my good man, do not sheer off until we know whether you are a
true measure of diagrams, or whether all men are equally measures
and sufficient for themselves in astronomy and geometry, and the other
branches of knowledge in which you are supposed to excel them.
Theod. He who is sitting by you, Socrates, will not easily avoid
being drawn into an argument; and when I said just now that you
would excuse me, and not, like the Lacedaemonians, compel me to
strip and fight, I was talking nonsense-I should rather compare you to
Scirrhon, who threw travellers from the rocks; for the Lacedaemonian
rule is "strip or depart," but you seem to go about your work more
after the fashion of Antaeus: you will not allow any one who
approaches you to depart until you have stripped him, and he has
been compelled to try a fall with you in argument.
Soc. There, Theodorus, you have hit off precisely the nature of my
complaint; but I am even more pugnacious than the giants of old, for I
have met with no end of heroes; many a Heracles, many a Theseus,
mighty in words, has broken my head; nevertheless I am always at
this rough exercise, which inspires me like a passion. Please, then,
to try a fall with me, whereby you will do yourself good as well as
me.
Theod. I consent; lead me whither you will, for I know that you
are like destiny; no man can escape from any argument which you may
weave for him. But I am not disposed to go further than you suggest.
Soc. Once will be enough; and now take particular care that we do
not again unwittingly expose ourselves to the reproach of talking
childishly.
Theod. I will do my best to avoid that error.
Soc. In the first place, let us return to our old objection, and see
whether we were right in blaming and taking offence at Protagoras on
the ground that he assumed all to be equal and sufficient in wisdom;
although he admitted
the many, will have just the opposite effect upon him; and as he grows
older, instead of turning philosopher, he will come to hate
philosophy. I would recommend you, therefore, as I said before, not to
encourage yourself in this polemical and controversial temper, but
to find out, in a friendly and congenial spirit, what we really mean
when we say that all things are in motion, and that to every
individual and state what appears, is. In this manner you will
consider whether knowledge and sensation are the same or different,
but you will not argue, as you were just now doing, from the customary
use of names and words, which the vulgar pervert in all sorts of ways,
causing infinite perplexity to one another. Such, Theodorus, is the
very slight help which I am able to offer to your old friend; had he
been living, he would have helped himself in a far more gloriose
style.
Theod. You are jesting, Socrates; indeed, your defence of him has
been most valorous.
Soc. Thank you, friend; and I hope that you observed Protagoras
bidding us be serious, as the text, "Man is the measure of all
things," was a solemn one; and he reproached us with making a boy
the medium of discourse, and said that the boy's timidity was made
to tell against his argument; he also declared that we made a joke
of him.
Theod. How could I fail to observe all that, Socrates?
Soc. Well, and shall we do as he says?
Theod. By all means.
Soc. But if his wishes are to be regarded, you and I must take up
the argument, and in all seriousness, and ask and answer one
another, for you see that the rest of us are nothing but boys. In no
other way can we escape the imputation, that in our fresh analysis
of his thesis we are making fun with boys.
Theod. Well, but is not Theaetetus better able to follow a
philosophical enquiry than a great many men who have long beards?
Soc. Yes, Theodorus, but not better than you; and therefore please
not to imagine that I am to defend by every means in my power your
departed friend; and that you are to defend nothing and nobody. At any
rate, my good man, do not sheer off until we know whether you are a
true measure of diagrams, or whether all men are equally measures
and sufficient for themselves in astronomy and geometry, and the other
branches of knowledge in which you are supposed to excel them.
Theod. He who is sitting by you, Socrates, will not easily avoid
being drawn into an argument; and when I said just now that you
would excuse me, and not, like the Lacedaemonians, compel me to
strip and fight, I was talking nonsense-I should rather compare you to
Scirrhon, who threw travellers from the rocks; for the Lacedaemonian
rule is "strip or depart," but you seem to go about your work more
after the fashion of Antaeus: you will not allow any one who
approaches you to depart until you have stripped him, and he has
been compelled to try a fall with you in argument.
Soc. There, Theodorus, you have hit off precisely the nature of my
complaint; but I am even more pugnacious than the giants of old, for I
have met with no end of heroes; many a Heracles, many a Theseus,
mighty in words, has broken my head; nevertheless I am always at
this rough exercise, which inspires me like a passion. Please, then,
to try a fall with me, whereby you will do yourself good as well as
me.
Theod. I consent; lead me whither you will, for I know that you
are like destiny; no man can escape from any argument which you may
weave for him. But I am not disposed to go further than you suggest.
Soc. Once will be enough; and now take particular care that we do
not again unwittingly expose ourselves to the reproach of talking
childishly.
Theod. I will do my best to avoid that error.
Soc. In the first place, let us return to our old objection, and see
whether we were right in blaming and taking offence at Protagoras on
the ground that he assumed all to be equal and sufficient in wisdom;
although he admitted