THEAETETUS [22]
to contend of
any ordinances which the state thought and enacted to be good that
these, while they were in force, were really good;-he who said so
would be playing with the name "good," and would, not touch the real
question-it would be a mockery, would it not?
Theod. Certainly it would.
Soc. He ought not to speak of the name, but of the thing which is
contemplated under the name.
Theod. Right.
Soc. Whatever be the term used, the good or expedient is the aim
of legislation, and as far as she has an opinion, the state imposes
all laws with a view to the greatest expediency; can legislation
have any other aim?
Theod. Certainly not.
Soc. But is the aim attained always? do not mistakes often happen?
Theod. Yes, I think that there are mistakes.
Soc. The possibility of error will be more distinctly recognized, if
we put the question in reference to the whole class under which the
good or expedient fall That whole class has to do with the future, and
laws are passed under the idea that they will be useful in after-time;
which, in other words, is the future.
Theod. Very true.
Soc. Suppose now, that we ask Protagoras, or one of his disciples, a
question:-O, Protagoras, we will say to him, Man is, as you declare,
the measure of all things-white, heavy, light: of all such things he
is the judge; for he has the criterion of them in himself, and when he
thinks that things are such as he experiences them to be, he thinks
what is and is true to himself. Is it not so?
Theod. Yes.
Soc. And do you extend your doctrine, Protagoras (as we shall
further say), to the future as well as to the present; and has he
the criterion not only of what in his opinion is but of what will
be, and do things always happen to him as he expected? For example,
take the case of heat:-When an ordinary man thinks that he is going to
have a fever, and that this kind of heat is coming on, and another
person, who is a physician, thinks the contrary, whose opinion is
likely to prove right? Or are they both right?-he will have a heat and
fever in his own judgment, and not have a fever in the physician's
judgment?
Theod. How ludicrous!
Soc. And the vinegrower, if I am not mistaken, is a better judge
of the sweetness or dryness of the vintage which is not yet gathered
than the harp-player?
Theod. Certainly.
Soc. And in musical composition-the musician will know better than
the training master what the training master himself will hereafter
think harmonious or the reverse?
Theod. Of course.
Soc. And the cook will be a better judge than the guest, who is
not a cook, of the pleasure to be derived from the dinner which is
in preparation; for of present or past pleasure we are not as yet
arguing; but can we say that every one will be to himself the best
judge of the pleasure which will seem to be and will be to him in
the future?-nay, would not you, Protagoras, better guess which
arguments in a court would convince any one of us than the ordinary
man?
Theod. Certainly, Socrates, he used to profess in the strongest
manner that he was the superior of all men in this respect.
Soc. To be sure, friend: who would have paid a large sum for the
privilege of talking to him, if he had really persuaded his visitors
that neither a prophet nor any other man was better able to judge what
will be and seem to be in the future than every one could for himself?
Theod. Who indeed?
Soc. And legislation and expediency are all concerned with the
future; and every one will admit that states, in passing laws, must
often fail of their highest interests?
Theod. Quite true.
Soc. Then we may fairly argue against your master, that he must
admit one man to be wiser than another, and that the wiser is a
measure: but I, who know nothing, am not at all obliged to accept
the honour which the advocate of Protagoras was just now forcing
upon me, whether I would or not, of being a measure of anything.
Theod. That is the
any ordinances which the state thought and enacted to be good that
these, while they were in force, were really good;-he who said so
would be playing with the name "good," and would, not touch the real
question-it would be a mockery, would it not?
Theod. Certainly it would.
Soc. He ought not to speak of the name, but of the thing which is
contemplated under the name.
Theod. Right.
Soc. Whatever be the term used, the good or expedient is the aim
of legislation, and as far as she has an opinion, the state imposes
all laws with a view to the greatest expediency; can legislation
have any other aim?
Theod. Certainly not.
Soc. But is the aim attained always? do not mistakes often happen?
Theod. Yes, I think that there are mistakes.
Soc. The possibility of error will be more distinctly recognized, if
we put the question in reference to the whole class under which the
good or expedient fall That whole class has to do with the future, and
laws are passed under the idea that they will be useful in after-time;
which, in other words, is the future.
Theod. Very true.
Soc. Suppose now, that we ask Protagoras, or one of his disciples, a
question:-O, Protagoras, we will say to him, Man is, as you declare,
the measure of all things-white, heavy, light: of all such things he
is the judge; for he has the criterion of them in himself, and when he
thinks that things are such as he experiences them to be, he thinks
what is and is true to himself. Is it not so?
Theod. Yes.
Soc. And do you extend your doctrine, Protagoras (as we shall
further say), to the future as well as to the present; and has he
the criterion not only of what in his opinion is but of what will
be, and do things always happen to him as he expected? For example,
take the case of heat:-When an ordinary man thinks that he is going to
have a fever, and that this kind of heat is coming on, and another
person, who is a physician, thinks the contrary, whose opinion is
likely to prove right? Or are they both right?-he will have a heat and
fever in his own judgment, and not have a fever in the physician's
judgment?
Theod. How ludicrous!
Soc. And the vinegrower, if I am not mistaken, is a better judge
of the sweetness or dryness of the vintage which is not yet gathered
than the harp-player?
Theod. Certainly.
Soc. And in musical composition-the musician will know better than
the training master what the training master himself will hereafter
think harmonious or the reverse?
Theod. Of course.
Soc. And the cook will be a better judge than the guest, who is
not a cook, of the pleasure to be derived from the dinner which is
in preparation; for of present or past pleasure we are not as yet
arguing; but can we say that every one will be to himself the best
judge of the pleasure which will seem to be and will be to him in
the future?-nay, would not you, Protagoras, better guess which
arguments in a court would convince any one of us than the ordinary
man?
Theod. Certainly, Socrates, he used to profess in the strongest
manner that he was the superior of all men in this respect.
Soc. To be sure, friend: who would have paid a large sum for the
privilege of talking to him, if he had really persuaded his visitors
that neither a prophet nor any other man was better able to judge what
will be and seem to be in the future than every one could for himself?
Theod. Who indeed?
Soc. And legislation and expediency are all concerned with the
future; and every one will admit that states, in passing laws, must
often fail of their highest interests?
Theod. Quite true.
Soc. Then we may fairly argue against your master, that he must
admit one man to be wiser than another, and that the wiser is a
measure: but I, who know nothing, am not at all obliged to accept
the honour which the advocate of Protagoras was just now forcing
upon me, whether I would or not, of being a measure of anything.
Theod. That is the